Giving Thanks
Nate, Dan, Bill and Leon commemorate a cornerstone of Drexel Basketball's passing and discuss what they liked and didn't like from the 0-3 stretch the men had and mostly positives from the women's 2-0 outing in the past week
Transcript
Welcome to Dragonscast
Nate H: All right. Hello everybody, and welcome to Dragonscast, the Drexel basketball podcast. I'm Nate, and then we've got, uh, Leon, bill, and then Dan with us as always here tonight. Uh, taping on a Sunday night. I just walked in the door. I made them wait. Unfortunately, I apologize to you guys for that, by the way.
Nate H: Uh, but, um, I, we will touch on this later. Had an opportunity to get my kids to the Palestra for the first time. I know a lot of people whine about the Palestra. I love it. I, it was just really cool to take them there, but cut it close getting back here. So, appreciate you guys having the patience, and then hopefully put together something that's worth listening to here tonight.
Remembering Timer
Nate H: So, and, um, yeah, we wanted to start, of course, a lot of basketball to talk about. But, uh, unfortunately, uh, and I know him as Timer, and I'm probably gonna call him Timer throughout, uh, the, or, or talk about him here today. But of course, uh, Dave Clawson, uh, you know, probably more appropriately known as, uh, found out that he passed away earlier this week.
Nate H: And, uh, You know, I just describing my relationship with him. I think like a lot of us, I was thinking about this on the drive home here, you know, we, you know, I'm in that, I guess millennial generation, I'm not really sure what I am. We have those types of relationships where, you know, somebody on an internet basis and then, you know, and then one way or another you get a chance to see him in person.
Nate H: And it's just kind of weird cuz like you feel like you know him but you don't. Uh, but we actually had a little bit of a chance to cross it to that kind of like knowing each other, not just on the internet. And um, I was lucky enough to talk with him at the women's tournament last year because, uh, he came out to support the women's team despite, uh, stage four prostate cancer.
Nate H: I think a lot of our discussion was about his treatment and I think at that point he was involved in an experimental treatment and, um, you know, just, just had that experience of talking to somebody and having that talk of you get an opportunity to do something in your life. You do it. You know, that's why Yeah.
Nate H: I mean, Tonight we cut a little close coming back, but you get a chance to take your kids to the Palestra and see basketball there. You take 'em cuz you don't know what could happen tomorrow or the day after hell, the next minute. Um, so that was a lot of what he talked about and I know that's some of what I take from him.
Nate H: You know, again, just supporting Drexel to the end. And his wife had made a comment that supporting a Phillies to the end and then went to his class reunion, you know, one of the last things that he did. And, um, I was debating Thursday last, or Wednesday last week, whether to go to mine and I was like, you know, he went to his and you know, again, you have that opportunity to do something, you do it.
Nate H: Uh, so again, I was lucky to have that conversation with him, which took us a little behind just the, the internet relationship. So, um, but I know, um, Dan too, you, you had something to share. So what do you, what do you got for us?
Dan C: Yeah, I, I mean a little bit here. And, um, noted here Dave was the ju class of 1975, which led to my running jokes with the old man, right? He started scoring in hieroglyph. Moved onto the abacus and ended up with that Dros jumbotron that sat up there until this year. Um, and the fact that, uh, he leaves us when that new monstrosity of a scoreboard comes in, um, somehow another feels appropriate.
Dan C: Um, but it wasn't a technology thing. Um, because, uh, before the ca, before the, the Kurt Dragonscast Slack channel and the CSN boards and then the ca zone boards, there was a Prodigy group, if anybody remembers back then Prodigy, and I know that's where he met Jason Bra, um, Eric Jer, Frank Ola, guys, he's introduced me to.
Dan C: Um, but that's, that's a, um, a dragon, a Dutchman, and a blue head I just named. And that was very on par for Dave. Um, he really didn't care where you came from. He wasn't into rivalries as much as he was into just sharing the joy of the. And, uh, I thought that was, that was great. And I think that came through a lot.
Dan C: Um, but when the zone message board did come around, um, he was not just a member there. He was the moderator. And it wasn't just for Drexel. He kind of moderated, helped moderate the whole board. And I think he really viewed that as an opportunity to keep us, to give everyone else kind of a clean, safe environment in the internet to, to talk about the joy of Drexel basketball and, and, and ca basketball.
Dan C: And, uh, the internet could kind of be a hellscape, but it wasn't there. That's kind of, that board is what bloomed a lot of relationships. Nate, I think you and I met there. Um, you know, it's, he believed, uh, it should be, you know, a clean place. It should be how you speak, you know, uh, on an online forum should be the same as real life.
Dan C: Um, so, you know, he, he used that opportunity to, to extend that there and, and speak to us and, and then speak to me offline and, and, and many others. Um, I appreciated that. Um, the other thing about him being a moderator was that he knew the rules. He knew them better than the officials at the DAC two at Taps.
Dan C: Um, he, he sat that seat for 30 years, uh, the scores table, 30 plus years. Um, and he would sometimes tell me about, um, where, uh, where he had run with, runs with officials, we'll call it that. And I ran back through some old the emails. And 2014 there was a game against William and Mary Home. William and Mary, where Bruce lost the shit.
Dan C: Um, and, uh, and I had said something to Dave asking him if he'd seen kind of, um, some of the things that I thought he'd seen that, that Bruce thought he'd seen, seen. And, um, he gave me a number of technical examples, but then he gave me one, which is the official, uh, there was a question on whether is a two pointer or a three pointer shot, whether he, Chris f stepped on the line, I think is what is what it was.
Dan C: And, uh, the official motion to the table. Kind of to mark the spot on the tape that they were gonna replay that, you know, you, you've probably seen the mechanism of games before when the officials motion the table there, that they're gonna go back and take a look at it. And, um, half time came and the officials started leaving and Dave had to call 'em over to remind them they had a review still to do.
Dan C: So it was, it was just a crew that had a really, really bad game. Yes. Brew was right, like, you know, and he had just a great story after Great story like that where, you know, some, sometimes crews are really good and sometimes they're right and sometimes we all got a good chuckle out of it. And I think regardless he enjoyed the part where, you know, they'd have to come around again in another month to do another game and he'd see them pre-game and they'd get to catch up.
Dan C: And that chuckle with the refs about what happened last time. I think it was something that he really enjoyed. Um, you know, I have notes here, but you know, he, he kind of, he, he was a doer, not a talker, um, just, he wasn't just community member, he was in Alliance Club. He wasn't just, uh, to your point, na, he didn't just attend the 50 year reunion.
Dan C: He helped organize it. For our space in the zone and everything else. He helped moderate. He, he was about going out there and making the community as strong as he could wherever he was. And I thought that that was an example, um, I certainly tried to learn from. It's also something where I wanted to mention for anybody else who's out there who's considering joining us on Dragonscast or on the CSM boards, um, this is a great time to do it, um, to to live up and, and enjoy that space that he kinda helped create, um, long before we were doing it.
Dan C: So wanna put that one out there and, and, um, I think he'd appreciate that. Last thing I noted is that he is a Drexel Hall of Famer. Um, he neither played for the dragon. He was not an executive for the Dragons. He's not a donor big enough to have a name on his building of the dragons and try to find a lot of Hall of Famers who didn't play for the Dragons.
Dan C: Run something or be a huge donor. It's gonna be a very short list, right? I mean, it's how do you make the Hall of fam not doing that? And the answer is, is just 30 years, uh, um, days like Kathy put on Facebook that a, a few months ago, actually, I think when our time on this earth is done, money or material things will not matter.
Dan C: But the love time and kindness we've given others will shine and live on forever. And I think that's why he's in the Hall of Fame ultimately. You know, he, he guided people. Uh, he should love to people. He was kind to people. And he did that for 30 years. And I think that's ultimately why he's in. And I think that is a unique story these days, and it's one that I thought was worth sharing.
Dan C: So, uh, that's why I'm here. That's why I wanna take that time tonight. Uh, also to say, Kathy, that if you were listening, uh, I never actually saw him once without you, um, They were inseparable. Um, and uh, it didn't shock me to see Kathy showing up on the message board then, uh, to announce Dave's passing and then to, uh, to make a witty market.
Dan C: One of the other members you knew that what, what Dave was doing, and you knew how it was important was Dave. And because it was important to Dave, it was important to Kathy. Um, you couldn't have had anybody better by his side. Um, and Cathy, you have all of our, I think, deepest condolences and respect. I'm back in the DAC recently, and Cathy, I really hope you keep coming and I hope to see you there.
Dan C: Um, and that, that's really my last note here. Um, great, great Drexel family, great friends and great people all the way across. So, so that's what I've got on Dave. But, um, I hope, uh, we hear more stories. I hope, I hope Kathy's gonna share some of 'em because they're great and, uh, I, I do, I I hope his legacy carries on cuz it's a great one to have within this program.
Nate H: Yeah. You know, and you just kind of said it too. My, you know, I, I think I had sent him a Facebook message a few weeks ago and I was like, you know, in part checking. I think I just asked like, how are you doing? Cause I, I notice, you know, and you know these people on social media too, that, you know, you put stuff up of your kids and they like it, they comment and stuff and, and I'm remembering too, he was always, you know, with Covid going on was always one.
Nate H: Being in the medical profession, there were hard days where you felt like you didn't have a lot of support from people, cuz you'd see what other people were posting and what you grew up with and it kind of bothered you. But he was always supportive of. What we were doing in healthcare during the pandemic too.
Nate H: So it felt like he, I had that support from him, but, and so I just sent him a message, but I noticed I wasn't seeing a lot of comments, so I sent him a message like, how are you doing? And wanted to check on him too. Cuz like you just said, I can't imagine the stories he has sitting at that scoring table over, you know, decades.
Nate H: And, you know, I always have that regret that, you know, we didn't get a chance to, I, you know, I look at the podcast as a chance to again, you know, get people on the record, you know, for, you know, forever. And, um, I, I kind of, I feel bad we missed that opportunity, but, um, but Danny shared a few things and I'm sure as time goes along, those different stories will come out.
Nate H: Um, but, you know, and it reminds you to not miss those opportunities in the future. So, and that's another thing I'll take away from this is that, you know, I know we all see people around the DAC and there's sometimes there's been that awkwardness, like I was talking about, Hopefully as time goes along, we get over that for different reasons with the, the new, you know, leadership that's in there.
Nate H: And then, you know, we can, can even have better relationships as time goes along, but still not be afraid to give somebody a hard time if we're not liking what we see. Which I'm sure there's, there'll be a little bit of that here coming up, but, um, yeah, no, um, I feel like I missed opportunity there, but, um, but now was just happy at least had that one conversation with him.
Nate H: So, so, uh, we will, we'll, we'll go through the games that happen to, and by the way, just one more comment and Dan, you texted me about something earlier. It seems like the athletic department really doing a nice job honoring him from what I hear, you know, there was a moment of silence before the women's game against Lehigh.
Nate H: I've been talking about something similar before the next men's game posted on the website, you know, right there on the front page and it was on social media. So little things like that I think can go a long way and it definitely shows that, that we're, we're trying to do the right things here, so.
Dan C: Yeah, and a lot of people over there have been there for, for a long time. They've worked with him for a very, very long time. They know him better than any of us do. So, um, you know, I look forward to, to any conversations that we can have, um, in that regard regarding Dave, because I know it's a loss for us all.
Nate H: So, so we will, and, and you know, you think of things you're thankful for. One, like I said, you're thankful you're still. And, and every day is a blessing. And then thankful for the relationships that you did have and the conversations you did have. So, you know, you, you, you think back to those things and you appreciate 'em more.
Drexel MBB go 0-3
Nate H: So, but, um, alright, so, um, so let's go and, and go through some of the games here. Um, so we'll, we'll talk about the mens uh, tournament. And again, correct me if the Florida Golf Coast showcase. Am I getting that right? Is that what we were playing down there in Florida? Um, so we, we played two games that we didn't necessarily talk about.
Nate H: I'm gonna just go through them. The notes that I have try to be brief and then we'll, we'll kind of go around and, and see what people thought. So, um, so we played after our win, uh, then we played Florida Gulf Coast for a, a shot at the tournament, the tournament championship game. Uh, we ended up losing 67 to 59, uh, pretty even game back and forth.
Nate H: And, uh, we were only down, um, a two point game at halftime. And then kind of a theme, I guess, And now as I think about it, and, and Leon was right, you do pick up themes here, but, um, which, and unfortunately consistent not so good theme. Uh, but let us go one for our last 10, uh, on, on, uh, from the field. And then for the game we shot 35%.
Nate H: We were nine of 18 from the line. Um, so it just felt like a game that could have gone either way. And then, uh, especially Thompson for Florida, Gulf Coast had a great second half. Uh, had, uh, 17 points in the second half and it was basically could have gone either way. One team was gonna make plays, the other team wasn't the teammate plays was gonna win.
Nate H: Fortunately it wasn't us. Um, so it was, uh, Florida Golf Coast that, uh, ended up pulling away. Uh, Marty Williams had a good game and I have him, um, eight of 12 from the line. So, uh, and that's been a good theme. He's been shooting the free throws a little bit better here, but bottom line just couldn't hit three, couldn't any shots good.
Nate H: Looks we were four 16 from three in the second half. Um, and then Coltrane was one for four. Yeah, they made the plates and we didn't, and uh, they pulled away and, and, and won the game. So we found ourselves in the third place game against Indiana State and we ended up losing that game, 85 to 81. Uh, I watched this on Thanksgiving morning and I, I just had this feeling, it was like, you know, same deal.
Nate H: I was like, we sat there seven, eight points down the whole second half and you know, just waiting for somebody to kind of break out and, and maybe help us go on a run or, and like I'll get into, I'm sure, you know, waiting for us to do something to maybe, you know, spark us meeting not the players. So that kind of narrows it down who I'm talking about.
Nate H: Um, but waiting for somebody to, to do something to get us, uh, spark and it just ever came. Um, and cuz and offensively, I mean, we were 11 of 21 from three, uh, you know, Amari, uh, even he only played 25 minutes, but at 15 points. So offensively we were pretty good. All five starters were in double figures, col trade at 16.
Nate H: But basically same deal. They had their places to go for points, including a gentleman whose name, I think it was like a villa, was his name, just was getting wide open threes and kept burying them and got to that point where their offenses, their, their buckets were easier to get than ours. So they were able to kind of extend their lead and we never made a run.
Nate H: So, um, so again, we just kind of, it was almost like we sat there content to lose by seven, eight points and, and head home. So, um, so we ended up fourth place in the tournament. Uh, I don't think it was necessarily the outcome we wanted good to get at least win, win one win down there, but felt like me, we could have done a little bit better.
Nate H: So, so we'll go around and I'm just going clockwise here on my screen. So, Leon, any thoughts you had on, you know, in general, anything that was bugging you or you're happy about?
Leon M: No. Yeah, I think you hit on some of the major points, right? Like both the games we were in it, it looked like we could have won either of those games, but we ended up walking away with a loss. Uh, both the games, they had a couple players that showed up and consistently, we had players that showed up too.
Leon M: And, and, well, to your point, free throws. They've definitely improved since the pen game because if we shot free throws like we did in those two games, these two games, like we at. To won the game. So I'm glad to see the free improvement in free throws, but I don't understand, and again, this probably goes more into the coaching piece than players where we, we when we can keep the game close, but then it kind gets away from us in the last five to eight minutes.
Leon M: So, uh, and I don't wanna jump ahead to tonight's, uh, game that recording after the temple game today, so I, I don't know what's happening where we get close enough it seems like to win a game or to compete, but can't seem to get the w which is, you know, everything else. And finishing fourth place, I guess is okay, except for when you think when, except for the fact that we still had wanted to, right?
Leon M: So for, we were in the middle of the Pack, which is I guess, what we expected to be this year. So was it disappointing? It was disappointing because the first game we were, we were so decis. Destroying the UT Arlington team. So it, it just boosts our confidence again, it's hype me up again. Like much to dance dismay, you know, so
Leon M: But, uh, it was, I, I thought we could have at least beat beaten Indian estate, and I think I would've been happy if we lost a Florida Gulf Coast, but came away with a win in this second game at the Gulf Coast Showcase.
Bill M: I mean, I think you look and you just see games that were winnable, that we just couldn't finish off here. Um, in both of these games, I mean, against Florida, Gulf Coast, like you said, like the defense was actually decent, um, for the most part I thought. Um, and then on the defense failed us, I think in the Indiana State game.
Bill M: So it was completely different. And one thing I did like to see in the Florida Golf Coast game was it looked like, um, Oak was trying to find his game. He didn't particularly play well there, but he looked more confident, um, in the Florida Golf Coast game. And I think that carried over into the Indiana State game.
Bill M: And he's been playing, he played better at Temple tonight too. So I like to see, to get him going a little bit. And getting his confidence up. Cause we need him to be, you know, spacing the floor. Yeah, I mean the Indiana State game to me was really, um, encouraging. I mean, despite the fact that the, the defense wasn't where it needed to be, you got to see some potential offensive firepower when the team is, you know, uh, operating at a decently high level.
Bill M: At least. I mean, Amari didn't even have a great game. He scored 15, but he hit like a late fade away three, uh, somehow to, to get him up to 15. And then, uh, but you had, you know, 13 from Justin Moore. had 12, he had Oden 16 coaching Washington 13. I mean, you got all your starters averaging, double figures. I mean, that to me was encouraging at least.
Bill M: Um, we were getting back door, cut it all night. , in that particular game, it couldn't seem to stop. It had no answer for it. And then, The one player who, um, was a D two transfer of some sort on that team. What was his name? Ledson. I mean, that guy was killing us. Um, and he didn't seem to make adjustments to, you know, stop him either.
Bill M: So, I don't know. I was encouraged a little bit then. Um, but I, again, this team just doesn't seem to be able to finish off the game. There's, they're playing well for most of it, and then we're staying right there with the other team at least. And then something just goes wrong. Maybe we don't have an easy enough way to get a basket when it's not aari.
Bill M: Um, and then we just flounder for a bit and the game gets outta hand a little. But that's my thoughts on those two games.
Dan C: So, yeah, I mean, I, I think you guys summed it up pretty well. Uh, one thing I have. I was looking at up for those two games, and it's still true after Temple actually, it got maybe slightly worse. We do have a Freshman Point card here on Justin Moore, and I think he looks really capable. I'm excited about him.
Dan C: Um, but when I looked at, um, you know, his efficiency numbers right now are, are horrendous. And by the way, opposing point cards are scoring like a thousand percent on their, uh, you know, from the field right now. They, they're scoring everything. So defensively I think he's a little soft, soft on screens and what, but offensively, you know, he's struggling despite the fact that this game looks better than that.
Dan C: And when I ask myself why I look at dude's taking more shots, um, then any of, uh, mate train or Oden, and in today's game against Temple, he took, um, Justin took 15 shots and that trio that I just listed of upperclassmen took six combined for 16. You can't, you can't ask a freshman point guard at a top hundred program on the road.
Dan C: You know, it's just, it's just not fair. It's just, you know, it's, it's, we're trying to put way too much on him, in my opinion. Um, and that's something I feel like through three games, that's an area where we are weak offensively. If, if, you know, technically metrics, air offense is about average right now, but if you make Justin more a plus player, you know, instead of asking him to do so much that he's a minus player, uh, I think that there's real good possibility for improvement there.
Dan C: I do wonder maybe if this is seasoning for conference play and we're gonna throw you into the fire and get, get you some experience before then it's possible. Um, you know, and the other thing I wanna jump too much on today, but yeah, I, I was looking for, from ATA to jump back a little bit, we saw a little bit, uh, at Florida Gulf Coast and, and, uh, I stayed there.
Dan C: I thought, bill, uh, and obviously then today, um, he played 37 minutes today. I had no idea. I thought it was like 20. I mean, honestly, I, I, I, I had, I was at the game. I was physically watching the floor. I had no idea he was out
Bill M: That's a problem.
Dan C: So yeah.
Nate H: Yeah. And just again, I mean, cuz we'll lump in and just, I mean, we lost today obviously. And then, um, it's kind of the same, this is a pretty consistent theme with what we've seen over the last week. So, I mean, yeah, lump it in there. We'll, we'll go over that. The same.
Dan C: That's really what I got. I guess the other thing I would take away is, um, dragons going back on to where we should be. You know, we haven't lost, uh, to anybody bad yet. Every, every loss here, Penn's a fairly quality team. They'd be decent in the CEA float. Gulf Coast is actually looking pretty good. Indiana State looks pretty good.
Dan C: Temple looks like they could be a top 100 team. So four losses, but none, none to be particularly ashamed of yet. Um, the flip side, old Dominion first game, if I throw that out, the only win is UT Arlington. Ut Arlington is, uh, 363rd and Field goal percentage right now. And for those of you counting, there's 363 Division one teams.
Dan C: So it's not like that's a great one. Um, what I'm saying is, is. It doesn't look like we're great. It doesn't look like we're particularly bad and that probably SATs you actually pretty decent in the CAA and with, with a lot of room to grow with a roster that's still transitioning and figuring each other out and getting Shane Blaney back.
Dan C: So, um, that's after, after those two games that Florida, Gulf Coast, Indiana State, that's kinda where I stood and I probably still feel that way today, but I'll, I'll let you guys talk about Temple.
Nate H: You know, the only thing I'll add about Temple is I just had this feeling of like, and I don't have notes, I haven't really broken it down, so we just got home, but it was like, you know, we got the lead and I, I was saying to, um, you know, Eric was there and then my kids, whether they're listening or not, when I tell him it was almost like, we're like, okay, we got the lead.
Nate H: We're good. You guys just go ahead and win. And, you know, temple went on that run, got up double digits, and I was just like, are we gonna press? Are we gonna, like, what's going on? So I hear what you're saying. We, we don't have a bad loss to a, a bad team necessarily, but then again, I just feel like we're back in that same position of staring at like a 500 record square in the face where, and I heard you guys throw out, I've heard two words that I've been thinking a lot about lately, you know, consistency and adjustments, uh, and kind of things that I, I feel like are, are things we need to improve.
Nate H: So, I mean, for me it's like, what do we do? Like you mentioned Justin Moore. Actually sometimes I don't feel like we're asking too much out of him today. I felt like it was also, I dunno if Cuz he was playing a Philly team, he, I liked it. He was playing like a little bit of a chip on his shoulder a little bit.
Nate H: But then again, there's other games where it's like, I don't know what his role is. And that's a common theme across the roster. It's like, what is the role? Um, so you guys feel that way and you feel like if we establish that, that can help with consist.
Leon M: It was that gold jersey today that you felt, you know, the, the rivalry jersey that we introduced when, uh, coach Fiker first came around? I feel now, yeah. Again, just, it's a lot to put on a freshman. To your point, Dan, the number of shots he's taking, but he seems to be, at least he seems to be taking it in stride.
Leon M: So that's the good news. Uh, the bad news is the Positionless basketball is not working out too great for us. Uh, yeah, I just, uh, I I think Amari, when he plays best, when he's in that center role, Justin plays best probably when he's actually passing. And, uh, even though he had some good shots today and we needed those shots, um, and, you know, we need our, we need more opportunities for our set shooters to get open and we need to run plays.
Leon M: We need to run a lot more plays just for cold train, uh, Mateo and, and Lamar even to, you know, get shots open and just take shots like, like run plays to double screen. I don't care. Just get 'em wide open for shots more. And, you know, this way at least, uh, we have more consistent opportunities to get some better shots out there as opposed to forcing it up sometimes, uh, from a freshman point guard.
Dan C: Throw the picket fence at
Leon M: Yeah.
Dan C: Yeah, I, I think, um, it's something I see sometimes We saw today a little bit, right? Coming outta the gate, Maite got a few shots. Um, and then that was, that was it. Um, but we see this sometimes and I think over the years with coach be and her staff, They'll come out really trying to stress getting somebody the ball out of the gate.
Dan C: Maybe you'll see it again out of halftime or out of a time out later in the game. But then as the game gets played on, we lose that. We kind of fold back into who we are. And, and I think if, if they have that stress, if they kind of know, hey, we gotta get this guy involved. I thought Col train did that. He had a, he had a couple takes.
Dan C: Um, he hopefully the worst first half of his career tonight, um, I had of him for breaking a layup, then fouling on a three and then fouling on an and one, and then leaving the game because he had two fouls, like I was, he had no points and two fouls in the first half. Um, he had a pretty decent second half in response.
Dan C: But, you know, those, um, those guys, if we're gonna say, Hey, we're gonna commit to them and, and we come outta the gate, getting the ball to matee and getting them some, looks like it's gotta happen for the rest of the 35 minutes too. You know, we, we shy away, we fall back into who we are and, um, There's a reason why they came out the gate like that.
Dan C: We, to your point, Leon, I think yeah, gotta push, gotta get those guys, especially this, this set shot shooters, um, in their spots and gotta get 'em hit cuz mate hit today. He just never got more than I think two or three opportunities.
Bill M: I mean, three shots for him in 36 minutes. That's, that's terrible. And I mean, he's not a guy who's gonna create his own shot, like Coltrane at least can go out there and he can create a little bit. I think that's why you see him shoot a little bit more. He doesn't necessarily have to, you know, wait for plays to be drawn up for him.
Bill M: Uh, Oak Gross is pretty much, he's a, he's a set shooter. I mean, he, he can drive a little, he's been missing layups doing that this year. But, um, for the most part, he is known as a shooter and he's just not getting those opportunities. And he's, like we said before, he is not good enough of a defender. I mean, he did a decent job at night, but he's not a good enough defender just to leave him out there for 36 minutes and take three jump shots.
Bill M: I mean, that's just not gonna cut it. Um, but I don't blame him for that, honestly. Like I said, it's, I think that's coaching. You need to, you need to find ways to get him. Spiker would drive me crazy with, uh, bicker staff when we had him. Like, I feel like we had a guy who was a mismatch nightmare in our conference.
Bill M: Um, and we just didn't give him the ball. Some days there was, I, I remember one game we lost, I think he was two for three from the field, similar to Oaks too. And I was just like, why are we giving this guy the ball? They can't stop him. Um, I mean, it's a little different. Oak Gross. I'm just saying, you know, hey, this guy can shoot.
Bill M: Let's find him opportunities to get open. Looks like that's all you gotta do. And then like, Oden looked really good last game against Indiana State and he has four shots. I don't know, you gotta find other ways. I mean, I think we, it feels like we're still in like a cam winter offense with a freshman point guard and I love Justin Moore, but you're still running your entire offensive game plan through him.
Bill M: I don't know, I think it's too early for, for him on that. I'd almost rather see him focus on, you know, distributing the ball a little bit more. You know, take those mid, mid-range jumpers when they give 'em to you take an open three here and there, but he's definitely forcing some shots. Uh, and he shouldn't be put in that position at this point.
Bill M: Um, we, we need other guys to, to step up who have been on the team longer. Like I said, when he took 15 shots tonight, then I mean, that's, that's a lot of, uh, that's a lot of volume. Um, especially when, you know, Oak Gross has three and Oden has four. You know, you need a little more balance out there and he can pass.
Bill M: I'd like to see him create, I think he, he set Mario up for at least three wide open dunks, just driving the ball. I like to see him do a little bit more of that, even though he is capable. He's a capable scorer and he'll get better as he goes along. I mean, he's, I think he's at least meeting expectations as a freshman, if not exceeding them so far, but he's just needs to be a little bit more efficient.
Dan C: I'm with you. I'm still really excited about him. I, I think he, he's, again, maybe this is trial by fire and getting him ready for conference play, but, um, yeah, he shows all the skill sets, right? He shows everything you kind of want out of there. Um, so, so it's just, you know, let's see that progress. The other thing, Nate, if, if I had one more, um, and when we talk about that, that kind of final 10 minutes of the games that we've been dealing with, there was a moment, um, in the second half today, I think it was.
Dan C: Reynolds for Temple. The big man, uh, went down. He got hurt and it looks pretty bad, actually. I hope. Hope he's all right. But, um, the next play, Amari comes out, um, gets to the line, hits his two free throws. And I turned to, to you guys and you probably couldn't hear me cuz Jim was deafening. Uh, nobody in it.
Dan C: They apparently just used the sound system to, uh, to make sure we couldn't hear each other. But, uh, I tried to shout to you guys and say, that's gotta be the next eight minutes, right? We've got a backup center on their team. Amari, Amari, just walk, walked in the lane, got fouled. This is gonna be like that.
Dan C: Tied up the game, those free throws. And, and I really thought, okay, this is gonna go bad. And as soon as I saw that happen, I go, okay, we got a shot here. And uh, the next shot Amari took was the 2 35 mark in the game. Can't happen. Can't happen. I don't care how you coach to get there. It can't happen. It was a, it was a three by COL train.
Dan C: He hit it, but then a, a mislay by Col train, I think it was rejected. Um, Coltrain, Coltrain, Justin Moore, Coltrane, and, and we never, I don't, I don't think he has a touch, to be honest with you.
Bill M: in that stretch, then why isn't there a timeout called you keep, you keep going down longer, further and further. Like this used to be a theme with the Spiker all the time, I feel like, where he wasn't calling timeouts enough time, but, and the lead would balloon to like 15 points and then the game would be over, like before it gets to 11.
Bill M: You know, you see the team's messing up. Justin Moore's got a turnover. It's a bad shot, it's a missed layup. Get a time out, regroup, come up with a plan. It's just, I don't know, simple coaching things I'd like to see there.
Dan C: Only thing Amari's got on the box score between the eight 15 mark and the 2 35. , um, is an offensive foul, and it was away from the play. It was, it was the illegal screen that was called on him, and we had a made basket that would've cut it to six. So yeah, just not involved at all. Um, against the backup center.
Dan C: Can't happen.
Nate H: Well, and you guys would talking about adjustments offensively and then, and defensively actually bothered me less today cuz we got so far behind so fast. Like you, I was trying to think if there was a timeout. I guess there wasn't. Because in the back, in the back of mind I was like, yeah, we probably should have tried to calm things down.
Nate H: But, um, but you know, it really bothered me in the Indiana State game not seeing really, you know, whether there's a press or even just going to a zone. I think there was one of the games down in Florida, we came out in the zone for like the first couple possessions and then we came out of it. But, you know, you could help the, the player, someone to mention how much we struggle to get easy baskets and if we could just get a couple extra possessions or a couple turnovers, get a couple transition baskets, and especially that Indiana State game, you go from being down seven to eight to being within maybe a basket or two.
Nate H: So yeah, again, just wanting to see some other things defensively too, to, to see if we could, you know, kind of, you know, get the other team outta sync instead of it's always us that seems like gets put outta sync. So, um, you know, and Dan, you know, you, you, you said something a minute ago, I was just curious about you and you said, we get back to who we are.
Nate H: Who are we? Can you answer that question? I can't, that's why I'm just kind of curious.
Dan C: It's not good. I don't know exactly what it is, but we're not, it's not good. Um, it, it tends to be, um, guys who look overmatched. Can I just, I mean, can we just I do, I feel like you put, I mean, Temple's a bit of an extreme example. They're, they're an AAC team. Is that what it is? The aac I don't even know, uh, the American, whatever it is.
Dan C: I mean, um, you don't necessarily expect the ca team to match up physically with them, but you know, we're a team that relies on system, relies on system, and that system, you know, is supposed to create open looks and, and hasn't been happening. And I think that's why you guys are, Kind of not excited about it right now.
Dan C: I, I, I'm not smart enough to know what the coach is doing right or wrong necessarily, but, you know, I I, I, I can observe and tell you, well, mark, William, you touch the ball, you know, when the lead's going away. Bill, I will say there was a time out taken by Spiker when they went down four at the 9 38 mark and a half.
Dan C: So he had just, he had just burned one of his second half time outs maybe he was trying to hold, but the next one, you're right, they were down 11. I mean, they just hit a three to make it only 11. Um, so yeah, probably was room for one in there. Um, but he did take one a little bit earlier. I don't know. I, we're doing a lot of coach bashing right now.
Dan C: It's, um, obviously after a game like today, it's gonna happen. Coming off of three straight losses against teams that were beatable probably gonna happen. Um, but I, I, I do, and as much as I'll criticize him for saying, Hey, Justin Moore shouldn't be leading the team in minutes with 38 today, I still think that's probably true.
Dan C: Um, you know, um, Berg is behind. We had a great conversation in the stance about how we, we actually supposed to. Pronounce that name. If anybody's sure it's Bergens, please let me know.
Bill M: They said virgins on the last, uh,
Dan C: Okay. That's what they were saying, the PA guy was saying. So maybe it's Bergens. All right, we gotta, I gotta get that right.
Dan C: So I'll talk to, talk to somebody, but, um, you know, he may need some more minutes. Something, there is a depth problem, right? Like, there is, who are you gonna put in, who's gonna be, and again, I don't wanna put too much pressure on, on Shane Blake because I've never seen the guy play, but I, you know, I'm excited about what Bill tells me about him.
Dan C: So I'm excited to get him in the rotation, have some more options. Luke House was holding us in this game for a good chunk of the first half. And again, I think that's a guy, um, who's a nice piece to have off the bench. But he is not the guy you want, you know, to his credit, he was getting the rim on them.
Dan C: He was actually making, just getting the layups against him, which was kind of crazy. But, um, he's probably not the guy you wanna be running your offense through either. Um, as much as you should be a nice contributor to that offense, so, Is it personnel? Is it coaching? I, I don't know. Um, and again, all these wins are, all these losses are against quality opponents, but the top half of the ca, not the top half, but maybe the top third of the ca is gonna be a quality opponent.
Dan C: They're gonna be better than these teams. As a matter of fact, um, you should talk about Tows and Charleston. Tows and Charleston win these games, win these games. So if you wanna be competitive in the ca, you need to start winning some of these games. Got Lafayette coming up, you gotta win that. But Princeton and LaSalle are gonna be good opportunities again, to see this kind of level of competition, which is, I, I would consider, you know, top half ca caliber competition.
Dan C: And you're gonna, you're gonna have to start showing me something at some point.
Bill M: I was gonna say, I mean, I don't know what's changing the offense, but just look back to when like Trevor John was on the team, right? Like Oak Gross is six six. Trevor John is what? Six two? Uh, I mean, I would, Trevor John's probably a better shooter, but, but Oak Gross should be able to at least put up more shots.
Bill M: Like I, I don't know what the difference is and where Trevor John was getting open all the time and finding looks, and we can't get ocra even looks at the basket or, or Odin looks at the basket like we should be generating more. Open three pointers, especially when you have Amari who commands a double team in there.
Bill M: And if they don't, he is pretty much gonna score. Um, although with Amari, I would like to see him go right. Occasionally he just , I dunno if anyone else
Nate H: We were talking about that. Yeah. And I feel like the defenders are cheating to the, so you basically, There and, cause there are a couple you could see if you'd spun baseline, you would've a layup.
Bill M: just needs a drop step and then a right-handed layup and he'll, he'll, he'll be killing people. They, they won't, they can't just overplay that to the side, uh, to his left hand all the time.
Leon M: He'd rather go away from the basket and take a longer shot left-handed. That sometimes misses because it's farther away from the basket as opposed to just spin towards the basket.
Bill M: Yeah,
Nate H: go there and dunk that man. Yeah, there's so many like that.
Bill M: it's a simple move. He should, I mean, he's just not comfortable obviously, but if he gets that, he'll be unstoppable. I mean, he is already pretty much unstoppable, but um, yeah, just being able to go right a little bit will really help his game out. And that's nitpicking. Amari's been fantastic all years so far.
Bill M: Um, the one thing I wanna say, the Indiana State game, when they brought in that, I think it was Ave or Avela, um, he pulled Amari away from the hoop. He was, uh, you know, six 10 or something. He's out there shooting threes. And what that did was it took Amari away defensively inside, he kind of had to float out towards the perimeter.
Bill M: And I'm interested to see if more teams do that and try to, you know, lure him out so that he can't just be sitting back in the paint. And then if we make an adjustment to somehow, you know, if we play zone or we, you know, switch up more to keep him inside because our defense is so much better when he's in there.
Bill M: Um, and I think Indiana State exploited that, um, really to their advantage. And he's not that comfortable guarding out on the perimeter anyway. He gave up a couple threes of that guy. But overall, Marty's been great. I don't wanna bash him at all. He's been fantastic. Needs some more support for him.
Nate H: And just so I, and so I'm clear of where I stand, you know, and, and I guess my, part of my, what I, what bothered me this. I felt like, again, we, I want it better for the players. Like I'm looking in, like I feel like what I see on the floor. I see, I think Oden's a talented player. We talk about Amari Oak, you know, I think he could shoot the ball at least likely.
Nate H: He's getting the lane a little bit. I mean, that's the kind of adjustment I wanna see add to his game, not just being a spot shooter. I mean, you know, Justin Moore is a talented young friend. I mean, go down the list. I look at these guys and at one point we had a lineup in there with, was it Amari Williams?
Nate H: Um, and then the other freshman, Hargrove, if I'm saying his name right, I mean we had good size on the floor. Oden I think was out there. I'm like, wow, this is a big lineup. And you know, it just, I feel like we're not quite getting, you know, a few years ago we brought in that class, Amari Williams, uh, o.
Nate H: Xavier Bell and I was like, all right, we got players now. Like I feel like these are finally guys that can compete in the caa. So what are we gonna do with these guys? And, and I, I feel like we have more pieces that are at the CAA level than we did before. And all I wanna see is like the foundation lead.
Nate H: Okay, this is Drexel basketball. Like this is how we're gonna play. That's why I asked who are we, you know, you think of, um, and of course I'm sitting here, I can't think of, you know, I'm gonna see Penn tonight, right? So Penn's always gonna have that guy like Slacker, who is a spot shooter, he's gonna kill you from three.
Nate H: And they're always gonna have that athletic guard too, that can do a little bit of everything, drive, shoot. And then actually they have a big man now. He had a nice game for them against Delaware tonight, but even 10, 15 years later and coaching ch changes. Penn has a way you kind of state that they play and, and I hate and hey, bruiser Flint, right?
Nate H: We knew we were gonna be a man-to-man defensive team. We were gonna go inside work inside out. And that was almost to a fault, you know? Um, now I feel like we've swung the other way where it's like, I don't know who we are. So it's like kind of figure out, okay, how are we gonna play with these guys?
Nate H: Getting certain guys a certain number of looks game after game, and then, and then seeing that get better game by game week by week. I mean, that's really all I'm looking for as we stand here and, and I hope we, we start seeing that. Yeah. Again here in the coming weeks.
Bill M: I mean, I think consistently the defense has been better this year, right? So that's gotta be some sort of emphasis because early on in Spiker's tenure here, it's been bad. I mean, early on, especially the defense is, was bad. Um, and it looks better this year. I think some of that is just, we have better athletes.
Bill M: We have guys who can defend at a higher level. Um, but it has to be a focus. Um, so if we can somehow get, you know, the offensive that we used to have when he first came in, like even with inferior players, I feel like to these guys that, you know, we were scoring more points, um, that, you know, this can be a successful team.
Bill M: I think we do have some talent. It's, you know, it's young. Uh, in some cases it's, it's new to the team. It's, you know, they're still working to get this thing figured out. Um, so we'll see how it goes as the season progresses, but, um, we just need to be more consistent too. I just feel like, you know, a couple of the guys look really great one game and the next game they're barely shooting.
Bill M: So I don't really know how to fix that. But, um, you know, I don't, I don't think it's completely a talent issue. I think the team's actually more talented than I thought we would be coming in. Just need that consistency.
Leon M: And we are a young team, right? So I gotta cut ourselves a little bit of slack here, but it's just the lack of adjustment or the consistent way we've been losing across these three games. I think, uh, more the Indiana State game and the temple game today, I feel like really, really, uh, leaves a bad taste.
The Good, Bad and the Ugly
Leon M: But, um, With that. I know we've been talking about the men's game, we probably jumped to the women's game, but I kind of wanted to sneak in a new segment over here where, uh, I wanted to kind of get your guys' take on, uh, the good, bad and the ugly. And this doesn't have to be any person or, uh, or it could be a thing or something that the player team's been doing.
Leon M: And it would be one, and it doesn't all have to have one in each bucket. We could stack the goods if it's ha it's been a good time and we can, uh, have more uglies if it's been uglier than usual. So, but I did want us to kind of have a general, see if we could come to a general consensus on what's been good, what's been bad, or what's been ugly in that sense.
Leon M: So with an attempt at that bill, if you had to pick something that was good, and again, we're thinking more just the last three games, what would you say was a good thing to come out of the last three games?
Bill M: Um, well, I mean, Amari's been good all year, so I think he gotta put his just overall general play. He's just, he is who we, who we thought he was gonna be this year, right? Like, I think he's probably gonna be the top big man in the conference, still playing well defensively, you know, without him we really don't have a go-to guy.
Bill M: So I think that's one of the good. I also like that I'll put good is Oak Gross. Even though he's struggled to get shots up today, I still like that he looks more confident, uh, early on in the season. I, I just, you could tell it was just the confidence wasn't there. I, I don't know what was going on, but it just seemed like it wasn't there.
Bill M: The last three games, you know, Florida Gulf Coast, he was. Searching for it, found it. And the last two games he's been shooting much better. Um, so I'll put that in the good.
Leon M: Very, as always, optimist Bill. He's already putting Oak Crows in the good bucket over here
Bill M: We just need to get him more shots. The fact that I want him to take more shots now is a, is a good thing. I mean, the previous games I would've been like, nah, he looks terrible out there. Don't get him any shots. Uh, but now, uh,
Leon M: hesitates too much. That's the biggest difference.
Bill M: needs a launch.
Leon M: Him and Trevor John. The biggest difference I noticed is that when Trevor got the ball, it was going up, it was a quick release and he added up there. He still hesitates. He just for that one second where that's enough sometimes for these better defenses to get up on you.
Leon M: But, uh, do you guys agree with the good in gen, uh, from, from a, from an Imari standpoint at least? Uh, , I think. Is there any consensus on that?
Dan C: I agree with him both actually. I, I, mate, mate looked, he did, he looked better. I mean, the shots went in right. So, so, um, I was really worried that there was an actual, you know, there was a physical injury, um, or something. Cause he was just so far off and, and now I feel like he's. He's who we think he is, which is, which is a good shooter to, great shooter to have out there.
Dan C: Um, can I add one? Uh, cause I think train, uh, is, uh, he's sitting 51% from three right now for the year. That's, that's pretty good that that'll play. Uh, that's on 35 attempts. So leads the team on attempts and still shooting at over a 50% clip. Pretty solid.
Bill M: even tonight. His defense wasn't bad at times. I mean, battles had some tough shots. I think he blocked them once and he had those early foul down. But the second half I thought like he at least, you know, was getting a hand up in, uh, up in his face. It just wasn't, you know, stopping him. But I thought his defense has even solid night too.
Bill M: But yeah, his shooting has been crucial.
Nate H: No. And, and, well, Cole, har Grove, I, I think, I can't remember how he said his name earlier, but, um, you know, I, I, I just throw him out there cuz I honestly, I like our roster. I, I mean, like, I'm, I pulled up our roster. I like, I'm looking through like, you know, there's always that guy that you're, Like, man, this guy's really, he annoys the crap outta me cuz he does this thing or that thing.
Nate H: It's like, no, everybody look through, they all show flashes of what they're capable of. And again, I, I'm thinking of my high school, like I said last week, won the state championship and I asked a guy who knows a lot more about soccer than I do. Um, and probably not as much as Dan. And, but, but either way I was like, how is Northwestern and Lehigh so good all of a sudden in soccer?
Nate H: And he is like, well, our coaches takes like, like the kids who, you know, go out and play club and are playing soccer 12 months out of a year and molds them well with the kids who maybe just play soccer for three months out of the year and puts that team together and it just works. Um, so that's what I see.
Nate H: Like, I, it's, I like our roster. I like the guys that are out there. I just, we just have to figure out again, who do we wanna be and then build that so that that's, we're at a good place, I feel like. And then not only that, it's carrying us forward, but then year by year, I know there's transfers and all that stuff that goes on, but just to a point where we're not rebuilding the foundation every single year deciding who we wanna be.
Nate H: Um, but I like the roster to say that.
Leon M: So with that, I guess that's decent amount of good stuff. So is there anything from a bad or ugly that you guys would add? Or is, is it mostly just good right now after the oh one three? We just had
Bill M: I think, yeah, O and three is both bad and ugly. Throw that right in there. Um, I bad, I think is just the erratic nature of mostly okras and, and Oden getting shots like, it's like, you know, you're a star one game, especially for Oden. Like he looks great one game and the next game just taking four shots. You just need to find ways to get those guys more buckets or at least more opportunities at shots.
Bill M: So that would be one, one bad for me.
Nate H: I'm just stopping at the, at the good things that I said cuz um, the ugliest is my opportunity. You talked about not being able to hear somebody at a game. We went to a Phantoms game in Wilbury on Friday night hockey, and we sat. In front of the most annoying group of kids I've ever sat around in my life.
Nate H: So they scream the entire game. Um, my, my mother-in-law had to keep her ears closed like the entire game, so that's the ugly for me. I'm gonna stay away from seeing anything else negative about the team for now.
Bill M: Unrelated to bad or ugly, we were at a rider game a few years back, maybe more than a few years back now. Um, Leanna, I think you
Leon M: Yeah. Yeah, I remember that game. Yeah.
Bill M: just had these little kids, I don't know how old they were, 10,
Leon M: They were cursing up a storm
Bill M: were trash talking to us like no other. Like I've never heard little kids trash talking like this before, but how.
Bill M: Which can you trash talk back to children? It's, it's, it's not gonna work out well for you either
Leon M: They, they were very close to finding out that night though.
Bill M: they were, they were about to cross that line, but yeah. Um, just a side note there. Sorry guys.
Dan C: I got ugly. I got ugly. Um, we went zone for like 10 seconds today. And when they did it, uh, Khali battle, uh, was was sitting, sitting in the corner and I swear to God, it looked like we snuck extra people onto our coaching staff. The entire coaching staff was pointing at him. I mean, everybody was pointing at him going like, Hey, hey guys.
Dan C: Shooter, shooter in the corner. Shoot in the corner perspective. We talked about call, train, leading our team in three point attempts. I think he's taking 30. That's taking 62 at this point in the season. Right. This dude is just, is Riling. So the whole staff is, and, and he sits there and we cheat so far off of him.
Dan C: And, um, he gets the ball that knocks down the three, you know, spikers crying and we never see that zone again. So that was my ugly moment. I mean, you just, you can't have the entire coaching staff telling, telling the defender you gotta be over here and then have nobody slide. It was just brutal to watch.
Dan C: And it was to, to the point of, of, uh, of changes and, and adjustments. Never saw that zone again. They so , they, they found out that was a bad choice, um, and went away from it after they got burned the first time. But, um, yeah, that's, that's, that was one, cause it was almost like a character. It looked like a cartoon out there.
Dan C: It was just funny to be watched from like,
Bill M: I don't know if this is a bad, but I don't, I don't love these two center lineups we've been throwing out there, whether it's Amari and Garfield Turner, or Amari and Cole Hargrove. I just, neither one of those guys can do anything from outside. It reminds me of like the old school Bruiser lineups where we'd have like, I don't know, Chaz and Frank in there, which worked back then, but I think now it's just, I don't know, we don't, we don't get enough out of those two guys together.
Bill M: We're not like, I don't even know why we're throwing it out there. We're not getting crushed on the boards. We're not getting beat up inside. I just don't understand the point of it. Maybe it's just a depth thing, I don't know. But it doesn't seem to go too well for us, and I think we have too little offense out there when, when that's the case.
Bill M: And it gets harder to feed Amari when you have another big band in there clogging the paint.
Dan C: That's a good one, I think. I think the idea, wait, when we had Justin Jennings on the pod was kind of that the mark could pop outside, but they're pretty clearly giving him a red light. You know, he has no interest in shooting from outside right now. So if, if he's not going to be a perimeter shooter or somebody who takes a jumper, then that doesn't make sense to me into the system.
Dan C: They do. I do think it would be a phenomenal, you know, thing to try out just, you know, going old school brew, putting two bigs out there and running a system that works with that, you know, offensively because nobody else is running that these days. And I think it would be really hard for other teams to prepare for, but that's not what we're doing.
Dan C: Right. We're, we're just trying to use our regular system with them already on the outside at the four, or I guess I'm already not playing a position cuz two, three and four positionless. Right. And and if they're not gonna let em shoot, that doesn't make sense.
Bill M: Yeah. I mean, he's barely, they're leaving him wide open. Your point then he's not, he's not taking that shot. I mean, you can hit it once in a while. Like he's hitting, he's hit some difficult. Threes. I remember a couple last year, he beat the buzzer on a few, like just, and he
Dan C: That Delaware game.
Bill M: Yeah. I mean, he can, I don't know how many you want him taking, but if you're gonna play him in that position, you have to, I mean, you're just neither Hargrove or Garfield Turners giving you anything offensively and you're not gonna be able to feed Amari in the paint with him in there.
Bill M: So, I don't know. I just don't love it. I mean, I was hoping you'd see maybe a little bit of Terrence Butler. I think he can at least shoot from the outside a little bit, but it doesn't seem like he's gonna play at all. So I don't think he can afford to have two bigs in there when you know those guys can't play on the perimeter at all.
Nate H: Just a quick point, Stan, about the zone. I'm, I guess we got there late. By the way, the ugly was a traffic on the Northeast Extension. I'm never late. Anything but yeah, we, and we were debating just failing at the Lehigh Valley interchange and taking 78 back to Mechanicsburg and the kids were like, let's go.
Nate H: So, I mean, and we guarantee to get a train ride. That's the thing why they like to go. So we were like, we're just gonna take the train, get to the game when we, when we, when we can. Um, so it worked out. But um, but just on the, the zone 0.1 is, I mean, you never know how much the coaching staff is telling the players what we're talking about.
Nate H: You're like, for Amari, you know, hey, it's been baseline. Um, so maybe they're doing it and then they're not, it's not getting cross. So again, you hope in the future it happens and we improve. That's all we're looking for. And the second piece too, just cuz you got burn on the zone once doesn't mean you bury it.
Nate H: Never go back to it. Maybe there's another point in the game where it could be effective. I don't.
Dan C: Fair. Fair. You know, maybe they did, but I think given how poorly it looked, I don't mind them scrapping it. There's what I would tell you, uh, before we flip over to the women's program, just upcoming week for the men Lafayette at home, that's pretty much a must win. I mean, if you don't take care of business there, then I would tell you we actually are taking on some water.
Dan C: And then, um, we go into the exam break with a Saturday afternoon game at home against my Princeton Tigers. So, um, puck fend and whatever else we say at Princeton, but it's a, it'll be a good one. Uh, the Tigers look good this year. They, they probably are one of the classes of the Ivy. It'll be nice to have 'em in kind of second, second shot at the Ivy League here at the DAC.
Nate H: Well, I'm thinking of it. If you want my tickets, let me know. Something else came up in the name of Brandon Graham is doing an autograph session and I hate paying for athletes autographs, but I bought a ticket and his time is right in the middle of the basketball game. So let me know. You want my
Dan C: Listeners, you can't have Nate's tickets. I'm taking Nate's tickets.
Drexel WBB go 2-0
Nate H: Yeah, I got four of 'em, by the way. So, but anyway, um, so no good. So, uh, so I go to the women and so played two games this week. I don't think I'm, I'm missing one. But, uh, we played on Tuesday night, uh, we played Lehigh and I was kinda looking for this to be a close game and it wasn't. And, uh, we ended up winning 84 to 61 and this was a game we did.
Nate H: I, I, I think a situation we played about as well as we could play, and I think Lehigh probably played about as bad as they could play. And right from the jump, I mean, we got up to a 14 four lead, uh, with a little under five minutes left to go in the first quarter. Keana had a great start. She had seven points.
Nate H: And, uh, just shot out, just took control of the game and outs. Scored 'em by 16. In the second quarter, LaBelle was four four from the floor she had 10. Mara Hendrickson was knocking down three pointers, which is key if she hits threes, I mean, that just adds another dimension to our offense. And then I, I had us only having one turnover in the first half and shooting 59% even head, head of SAT was three for three was six point.
Nate H: So we just couldn't have played better. Ended up getting up to a 34 point lead. I'll be honest, I kind of tuned out. I was trying to decide what hat I was gonna wear to my class reunion, so I was looking for this other one. And then I came downstairs and I think they were within like, maybe like, um, what's, I think I put down the deficit they got within 15, uh, early in the fourth quarter.
Nate H: And then we just kind of settled back down, got back to our business, and then extended a lead and, and took care of business. But yeah, it was, Keshawn ended up with 33 points, eight of nine from the line and uh, just, just took care of business is what it came down to. So,
Dan C: I mean, yeah, Lehigh. Um, I wanted to turn on the TV and then I decided I didn't need to bother. It was exciting for me. It was on NBC Sports Philly. I had it here, went to turn it on, and I was like, I don't probably need to need to make my wife watch this because this is a blowout city. So I, I, I turned it back off, so apologies to coach me Greg Cusick for that one ratings point, but, uh, yeah, phenomenal to see them.
Dan C: I thought coming off of the style loss, uh, the Eastern Shore game is probably closer than it should have been. They were kind of ripe for a bit of a breakup and, and, uh, maybe Amy got into them, I don't know. But, uh, it was good to see kind of the expected result.
Nate H: and then carrying over today, and I think, kinda like you said, it's, it's good to see us. You know, kind of really taken it to some teams and I thought they were gonna be close games and they're not. So we talking about the men's team playing teams, and I think maybe kind of, um, you know, right at our, our talent level, if not, you know, maybe a little bit above.
Nate H: Um, but, um, but this Buffalo game I thought potentially could be a tricky one. You, in the holiday, you're going up to New York and, uh, one again, easily 53 to 35. Uh, I listened to this game again. We were sucking traffic on the turnpike. Uh, so it was, again, we were trying to figure out what we were gonna do.
Nate H: So I didn't lock it on this like I wanted to, but, um, but basically just came down to, I mean, Buffalo it sounds like played just awful. Um, we didn't necessarily have our best performance either. I mean, we shot 37%. They shot 30%, but, um, we, good game from Grace O'Neill. Uh, she had really crossed the statute.
Nate H: She had, uh, 12 points, nine rebounds and three steels. Again, not the greatest games for Keana or Kylie Lall, but it was good enough is what it comes down to. And, uh, I, I guess I, I just kind of file this, you easy to go up and make a road trip over the holiday and play poorly and lose against the team that you're probably not that excited to play.
Nate H: But again, credit Coach Mallon for having him ready to play and a good idea too. I saw they went to Niagara Falls, so probably looked like a cool trip. So, uh, wasn't as mundane a trip. Wintertime, uh, well it's almost winter, you know what I mean? Um, but, and then plus Keana, they were talking about the radio being from Canada, so maybe as close to homecoming as we could get, getting it right up there near the border.
Nate H: So good planning on that road trip, um, to, to have some other site seeing, going on to keep people motivated. So I, it's just good we went up there and took care of business, is the way I look at it. So,
Dan C: Yeah. And now with the win at Buffalo Leon, you know, the projected record for the, for the women's. We're back. We're back on pace. We're back on pace. So I know, I know he loves a 28 and one. Um, I, I did like take a look at Buffalo's schedule to date. There's a chance that we overrated them massively. I think they're coming off of a D two loss coming into this game.
Dan C: Um, but Grayson, you'll go on all 40, um, in the box here. You know, she's really become, um, somebody who, uh, is really a quiet member of this team, I think doesn't necessarily fill up the box for anything else, but she's, she's the floor general and, uh, they clearly are happy with what they're getting out, out of her because they keep feeding her minutes.
Dan C: So it's kind of cool, even though we, we talk about, uh, Kylie and Keana a lot, just to see, uh, see another freshman face, you know, two real, I mean, Grace O'Neill, Kylie Lavell. I mean, we could be talking four years of hearing those names, 35, 40 minutes a game as a title contender year after year. This could be the next crew coming through.
Dan C: So it's kind of exciting to see from that perspective.
Nate H: Yeah, I just went back to double checking. For some reason I thought Buffalo was picked higher in the Mac, but they were picked 10, so I guess, yeah, it wasn't necessarily, but still a Mac team and again, still, you know, to go on the road and take care. Business is, is it's what we're looking for. So, and again, you know, and you hate to compare the two, but again, and, and you know, obviously Keana Washington is a different type of player, but you know what the women team's gonna do.
Nate H: You know that Keisha's gonna get hers and Cali's gonna do her thing. You have stuff to hang your hat on. And, and, and that's what gets you through those, those, and especially in the conference season where it's kind of a, you know, it's a long year and you just need to kind of, kind of slog through and good out wins when you know when the points are gonna come from and how you're gonna play.
Nate H: I think it really helps you. So, um, but you know, I'm looking at, just so I don't say anything else stupid, which I'm good at of course, but, um, but we play long wind neck, which I was thinking they were pretty good cuz I think they had a good team last year. But I'm looking, they're losing. Or they lost today, 89 28 to Virginia Tech, albeit Virginia Tech's 11th in the country.
Nate H: But, um, yeah, losing by quick math 61 points doesn't look that good. So, um, but either way, yeah, but either way it's a trip into the nowhere in middle of nowhere in Virginia on a whatever night. And I think the games at a strange time too. So still you gotta show up and play the way you play and, um, hopefully we do that later this week.
Dan C: This Longwood schedule's incredible. They, they, they played a full ca schedule already. They lost by 20 to Delaware, uh, by nine, uh, at thousands, and then just charitably by 27 to JMU honorary ca member in this, in this particular case. But yeah, these last two, uh, Virginia Tech, yeah, 89 to 28 is not great. Uh, the game before that was Louis will put up a C note hundred to 37.
Dan C: Um, so, you know, I'll tell you this, they're gonna be. The second straight road game, you're gonna, you're gonna be going to a Longwood team that's not happy. They did beat a decent Ohio team already, so it's not like they're, you know, they're not terrible.
Nate H: They're a wounded
Dan C: they, they've, yeah, they really are. They really are.
Dan C: I'm not, I'm not really looking. This is gonna be harder than it looks. I think going down to Longwood,
Nate H: Yeah. Nah, it's, it's, well, yeah, if you show up and play you'll be fine. But, and, and that's what's so awesome about this program. They, they never take a game off. So, um, I expect a good effort, um,
Dan C: gonna find that out because they've got, uh, St. Joe's, we play Longwood Wednesday. We've got St. Joe's on Sunday. St. Joe's a six and oh right now, big time. It's a look ahead spot. This is, it's long game. Scares the crap outta me now. Um, but you know, this is gonna be where you're gonna have to trust the coaching staff to have them in the right mindset because they gotta look at this game and this game only because it's real easy to see.
Dan C: These last two results long would have look past them at the six and oh St. Joe's team come up in front of you.
Nate H: Yeah. I, I, I thank you for that transition because like, and again, I'm not looking past long wind of course, but, uh, I'm planning to go Sunday to St. Joe's if anybody was thinking about it. I mean, and it's what I talk about, you know, women's basketball in the city is I think in a good place. And this is our biggest game.
Nate H: I think being involved with that. I know Bill Love, I think lost yesterday to Baylor, who's ranked to, it was a close game, you know, the whole way they just lost at the end. But, um, that's a huge game. Has that, you know? Yeah. It basically miss the days with the, you know, you think of the men's team when we play St.
Nate H: Joe's and how fired up I'd get about that. Um, so have the same mindset going to this game. It's gonna be a big deal next Sunday, so, all right. Um, any other thoughts?
Around the CAA
Leon M: I don't know if, uh, Dan, you wanted to give, uh, any updates, uh, from around the CAA standpoint, cuz uh, anything, I know Townsend had a loss, right? That, who did Townsend lose to?
Dan C: Yeah, they had a bad one. Um, it was Car Fairfield. I said, they be cop. They. On neutral site. The Fairfield, their, their tournament, they do go on to beat South Alabama and Mercer, both kind of okay teams. Um, so I guess they, they wrap up that tournament today. Um, so they gonna liu, but yeah, bad loss for them.
Dan C: Um, and it's gonna make the cries for Charleston to be considered the flagship. Go a little bit louder. Um, they came off of winning that tournament. Um, again, they played Davidson, Colorado State, Virginia Tech all at home. And that turning to win it, um, to a, um, pat Cal will let you know students weren't on campus home game against Kent State.
Dan C: Kent State's the top 100 program as well, and they won that one by two. So a lot of close games for them, but they're, they're coming out on the right side of all of them. Uh, they got Old Dominion at home Next, uh, they only left home once to, to play unc. Um, that was a game we talked about before, but they put up 86, they lost by 16 to unc.
Dan C: Uh, not a bad loss at all. They're probably at this point. Yeah, I mean with that loss by Towson, they're probably the flag bears right now. The Charleston is, but again, two real solid programs at the top. I'm not gonna penalize Towson too much for hip hiccuping once. Still think that game at Clemson in a few weeks is, is a big one.
Dan C: Um, Hofstra, um, goes to Canada, I believe. Um, so they got smoked by St. Mary's before the trip, that was last week. And then this, this week in the tournament, in their tournament lost, uh, to a good middle Tennessee state team. Um, and then picked up wins against a good Greensboro team. Actually Greensboro was pretty decent and then, um, slipped by quite a p in the final game of that tournament.
Dan C: They go to old friends George Mason next week, um, before, uh, the Wednesday following. They've got a buy game at Purdue. So that's kinda where the top of the colonial is. You don't wanna hear about the bottom of the colonial. It's, it's, it's bad. Uh, Elon might be Elon's, Elon's making a fight for worst team on the planet right now.
Dan C: Um, they just lost at home to Radford by 16 and no, Radford is not good. Um, so home lost by double digits there. I got a home loss to North Dakota. I noticed before, earlier in the season, um, their only win was a non D one. And they haven't, they've only played one top 200 team so far, um, for one in five, one D one record.
Dan C: So really bad. Stony Brooks worst that I thought. Um, they just got blown the doors off of them by Eastern Washington. Eastern Washington, not good. Um, they lost by 30, almost, I think 29 in that game. So the bottom of this conference, uh, needs work to say the least. William and Mary gotta win. William and Mary gotta win.
Dan C: Uh, got two actually, I, I, I think corrected. They beat Army and Radford before losing a pit. Um, so they may have more of a pulse. Rumors of their demise may, uh, especially relative to the bottom of this league. Um, but yeah, it's, it's not good. At the bottom still looks to me a lot like tows and Charleston as top two.
Dan C: Hoff is kind of a clear third, and then this grouping of Wilmington, Delaware, Drexel, Northeastern is gonna be your next four in some order. Uh, and then just the, and I don't know that Northeastern's necessarily gonna end up in that conversation the way they're playing earlier on that they could. And after Northeastern's just a cliff.
Dan C: Everybody's bad. Everybody's just, if you lose to any of those bottom six teams, you know, that's gonna really penalize you come seating time. Um, yeah, I mean, Northeastern's only win right now is an OT win against Manhattan. They just lost by two to Princeton on a neutral site. So again, they play that competitively.
Dan C: Um, and Princeton's a decent team, so we'll see them at the DAC next week. Um, I, I'm not, I'm not. I still think Northeastern's got a shot to be relevant and um, we'll see where they are relative to Drexel, but that, that phase, that four through seven is the bucket I definitely find Drexel in right now. And, and I think those are the teams that you wanna be looking at and comparing yourself to and figuring out a way to get in front of.
Dan C: Cuz you'll want it, you know, come seating time at the end of the year with 13 teams in the league. Now, it's gonna really gonna matter who you get in the post-season, um, especially with this big disparity between the top half group and the bottom half group. So there it is. That's, that's my, around the league.
Dan C: It's, it's not much. I, I should be doing a closer, closer watch, but we'll, uh, we'll keep that up next week.
Nate H: Didn't see in Del Delaware tonight. I think Jamir Nelson Jr. Had, I think he had 20 at halftime, and then he hit a couple shots in the, in the beginning and a half, he got up to 28 and then Good Penn took him away and I can't remember his last name, but 22 was defending him and doing a good job. And then Jer Davis, I mean, again, they, Penn is some decent size, so he had some trouble with that, but it just seemed like those two guys outside.
Nate H: Junior, Nelson Junior and then, um, and then Davis, they didn't really get any contribution from anybody else and Penn was getting it from all over the place. And then Delaware wasn't really playing defense. Um, so Penn just kind of pulled away. So Penn's kind of a common opponent I feel like, for a lot of teams and is gonna look at how the matchups work.
Nate H: So. Alright. Yeah, so get out to the games, you know, we've got Wednesday night Lafayette and then, uh, the men's Saturday and then, like I said, try to make that trip Sunday and support the women's program too. So,
Dan C: Yeah, that one's up at Haw Hill. It's not at the DAC, but definitely, I mean, that's gonna be a game to see. I think all five women's programs in the city are probably gonna end up being top 100 teams. So good to see good basketball.
Nate H: I'm glad it's a row game. I'm looking forward to that, so that should be fun. So, all right, and we'll see you guys next week.